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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:18:10 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 13 2014, 07:28 PM QUOTE(moonmagic @ Aug 5 2014, 07:57 AM) * I often show up for "Happy Hour" before it actually starts. Does this count too? mm
I'm kind of red shifted as I have "happy hour" after the last show!
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:21:51 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 13 2014, 07:38 PM QUOTE(moonmagic @ Aug 13 2014, 04:04 PM) * More congrats on yet another show topic. I've always felt that the Spitz GEOCENTRIC EARTH projector had some good uses. I don't remember it ever being a sold option for the A-1's or A-2's but I do remember it on almost all of the A3P's, A-4's, 512's and even 1024's. I also know that it was an option on the STP's although that one actually required two globes, one for each end of the projector so that had to be aligned just right or the images would overlap one another unless you had a separate control for each globe.
I was also always fond of Spitz's "Astronomical Triangle." These were adjustable such that you could play "connect the stars" such as showing the "Summer Triangle Stars" or tracing out other star patterns.
Spitz and his designers did some clever things over the years, at a price many more organizations could afford. mm
I have quite a few support projectors for the A3P as well as 512 projectors and I plan to incorporate a lot of them into my main system. Two satellite projectors come immediately to mind. Mr. Brent also cleared out the back rooms of a several places for me and I will finally have some time to resurrect some of these special effect homemade projectors that have seen better days. But what some consider junk I always consider "good junk" and I should be able to make something useful out of this extra stuff.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:22:18 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 13 2014, 07:38 PM QUOTE(moonmagic @ Aug 13 2014, 04:04 PM) * More congrats on yet another show topic. I've always felt that the Spitz GEOCENTRIC EARTH projector had some good uses. I don't remember it ever being a sold option for the A-1's or A-2's but I do remember it on almost all of the A3P's, A-4's, 512's and even 1024's. I also know that it was an option on the STP's although that one actually required two globes, one for each end of the projector so that had to be aligned just right or the images would overlap one another unless you had a separate control for each globe.
I was also always fond of Spitz's "Astronomical Triangle." These were adjustable such that you could play "connect the stars" such as showing the "Summer Triangle Stars" or tracing out other star patterns.
Spitz and his designers did some clever things over the years, at a price many more organizations could afford. mm
I have quite a few support projectors for the A3P as well as 512 projectors and I plan to incorporate a lot of them into my main system. Two satellite projectors come immediately to mind. Mr. Brent also cleared out the back rooms of a several places for me and I will finally have some time to resurrect some of these special effect homemade projectors that have seen better days. But what some consider junk I always consider "good junk" and I should be able to make something useful out of this extra stuff.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:22:55 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 15 2014, 02:52 PM QUOTE(mrgare5050 @ Jul 30 2014, 03:04 AM) * Ride the wave as long as possible! And yes I would use this time to be as creative as possible, later when the inevitable doldrums set in a bit you can pull out lists of things to do maybe. I always walk in the star chamber at odd moments because you never know when an idea will come.
Theres a balance here I think, between hobby and showman and teacher. Everyone maybe has a mix, a ratio if you will, and it may even shift over time.
I think mine has always been about 60-20-20 60 percent hobbiest, 20 percent showman (i may seem crazy but a little goes a long way) and 20 percent teacher (it has its satisfactions)
so maybe thats the home planetarium ratio - have we done that before .. 60-20-20. whats yours? are there major categories missing?
the gift shop lives!
I often review posts from time to time to see if I've actually absorbed all they have to say. In Gare's post I immediately latched on to the HPR and kind of ignored the first perigraph. Ignored or perhaps purposely shut out.
Yes, ride the wave as long as possible. But where on the wave does one ride it. Does one do the same show time after time forever, would that work. I know I've really started to get that introductory show down to a kind of science and it is very easy to do but how long can one do it before visitors dry up. Perhaps that is where the "inevitable doldrums" show up. Like anything, even this could get boring I suppose. I have read about a maritime planetarium that has given the same show for decades with a trusty A-1 projector. They even have the prow of a ship built up under the dome as part of the story. I'm not quite sure what the show is about but it fills up for each show. We all know that this works because there is a constant flow of vacation travelers through the area and to them the show is always new. I am guessing that it isn't a live show and that the narration is pre-recorded. Perhaps the faithful A-1 never moves and just projects a static night sky, a kind of background for the storytelling to come.
Now I can't put my introductory show in that same context as it is both live and it does change from presentation to presentation. The Sun, Moon, and planets change from day to day as do the constellations visible that night. So, in a way, the show is always new as the everchanging night sky is always new. However, I think to most visitors, once seen, the introduction to the planetarium and the night sky is just a rerun and need not be watched again.
I have been asked by a surprising number of people to do a show on how the projector itself operates. I believe a number of you had already mentioned this to me and I must admit that I basically dismissed it as the actual mechanical operation of the machine would only be interesting to mechanical junkies such as myself and certainly not the general public. As I have found out more and more lately, I was wrong (don't quote me on that) and a show of this type would be most welcome. Now this is an easy show for me to do (for obvious reasons) but hold on for a minute. How many people can I accommodate around the projector at one time before problems ensue. No, I probably need to make some kind of video and/or power point presentation so that I can present a larger then life view of the various workings of the machine. But then I probably need some kind of Video projection onto the dome to have a big enough picture for everyone to see. IT NEVER ENDS!!! huh.gif
Video projection is a must as it will soon be needed for a lot of future projects. The all dome mirror projection comes immediately to mind as does "The Christmas Star" presentation which will be very heavy in visuals as listening to me drone on with just stars over head could put a lot of people to sleep. Also I'm sure that most guest lecturers would probably have some kind of AV presentation to go with their talks. Then there is my plan to have live images from the observatory projected within the planetarium.
But, anyway, I digress, we were talking about "riding the wave as long as possible" and the length of that wave seems dependent on "being creative and innovative constantly". Once one stops the "inevitable doldrums" will indeed step in as a self fulfilling prophecy. And then, how do we define the "inevitable doldrums"? Are they generated by the people who have/will come to our shows, or are they generated by our own malaise. Perhaps it is a combination of the two.
I also make it a ritual to go into "the star chamber" at least once each day. Partly to prove to myself that it does indeed exist, partly to set it for the next day so the positions of the projections will be accurate in case a show request pops out of the blue, but also partly because, as you say, "you never know when an idea will come". More now it is what needs to be done, fixed, built, and from that new ideas of how to do it.
Rebuilding the power supplies for the laser projector is also up on the list as it would probably be a fairly good draw.
As hard as I try, I cannot get "inevitable doldrums" out of my mind.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:23:29 GMT -7
Posted by: mrgare5050 Aug 15 2014, 03:31 PM well word of mouth never goes forever it seems, inevitably the novelty wears off, there are just so many other distractions - for example, even retail now has died around here because its back to school, and the public gets distracted. I had 3-4 inquiries in March when it was still very very cold and i put them off, now (like some old country song goes), since the phone aint been ringing, i assume it aint been them. they vanished. of course im doing NO followup, NO advertising, no nothing. but thats what im getting NOTHING.
ive been thinking about this too ever since Ron you brought up the 'institution' comments we made awhile back - Ive been thinking about what KIND of institution i had envisioned, thats when the ratio came in for me. what did i really like - what DROVE me ... what kept me going, in my case, to continually remodel the place again and again like Noah trying to build some ark and god saying, no, thats not it, try again ... and i think you guys with your rooting for the newsletter gave me the answer. its where i came in. i like BUILDING planetariums. it was ok teaching, giving slide shows, recreating historical scenes with the stars, all that stuff i tried over the past years - but it came back for me to HPA. thats the kind of institution for me - that one thats the core passion - so now im setting up to show people how to build simple planetariums and getting HPA going again. i think thats why i have relied on word of mouth, which just doesnt sustain itself, i was OK with doing the kinds of shows i was doing but it didnt sustain my interest forever. once i did the titanic sinking, i did it. khufu .. i did it. i didnt want to do it over and over like those guys in St Augustine (the ship). so what DO I want to do OVER AND OVER. build planetariums!
so i guess maybe the challenge is, what takes YOU back out there every morning - i do that too - coffee in hand, i go fire up the cylinder and gaze in awe every morning . i want to build some more etc. thats the kind of institution i want to be. so you love the Minolta - Owen loves the old commercial machines too - hes got the museum . MM gave me a rare glimpse into his inner sanctum at the airport. then balance that core interest with how strong your love of teaching is . of wowing people etc. whats your core love i guess? because i think once i get my core mission going strong, THEN i will want to advertise and pursue people like crazy, and wont have to rely on the unreliable word of mouth!
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:24:07 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 15 2014, 05:24 PM I can see where you're coming from. My problem is that after working on this project for these many years there is no way I could start over again. Perhaps I needed a base level as a constant and from that I will blossom forward. wink.gif Come to think about it we are not all that different, your cycle is just a lot larger than mine. I do need the new and the change but I need the safety of the basic planetarium to fall back on. As you have found, "out of sight out of mind" is the way people think. With my basic structure I can always give a show from my basic repertoire, and that repertoire grows with each and every show that I generate. I have found as you have that saying "come back in three months" has the same effect as saying "I've closed forever". People will always find something else to occupy their time. I have had three occasions now that people were only available on a particular date and time. The small group that had to leave before I was finished because I had said one hour show and they plugged it into their day for that one hour. The other two small groups had been to the grand opening and had out of town guests. I felt really good that they enjoyed the show so much that they wanted to show it to their out of state family. I do this to build good karma as taking the time to bend to their time requirements very probably generated good will that will be passed along that slippery "word of mouth" trail.
Thinking about your March inquirers again, perhaps they were home school groups and are now out for the summer. Also March could have been the time they were all studying astronomy. You might be very surprised to find that they will call again in the fall or even again next spring. All one can do is be ready.
I have had an e-mail sign up list that I offer to each show at the end to see if anyone wants to be told of upcoming presentations. This has been consistently above the 75% of the visitors to each show. Now this is only after a show so I'm thinking those that signed up actually enjoyed it enough that they might want to come once again. I attribute that 25% loss to either people already on the list and family groups that need not list each individual member for a e-mail account. I think that the e-mail list is vital as everyone needs a reminder. I like to send it out two or three weeks before a scheduled show and slowly count up the RSVP's which invariably will come in the last few days. I even had one come in at 11am for the 1pm show. Without the e-mail nagging I'm sure I would be in "inevitable doldrums" already.
I am very curious just how far the word of mouth thing will go. The very fact that I have new e-mail sign ups at every show tells me that it is still expanding. We have put out a few feelers to the home school groups that we have belonged to with no results so far, but then school is just getting started again. I also don't really want to expand too fast as I am not yet comfortable with my knowledge on the subject. My primary goal is not teaching as much as opening minds to wonder and to search.
If indeed I can come up with fifteen or so shows over a two year period (there will be repeats), then I can see exactly how word of mouth falls off. Heck, if I can come up with twelve I will be happy. The problem now is getting new ones with the proper support equipment up and running. It takes time to make an hour show, especially one which combines live presentation with pre-packaged visuals.
My problem is that I set out on this journey and it is one I must see to the end.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:24:31 GMT -7
Posted by: mrgare5050 Aug 15 2014, 06:21 PM right, its about the shows for you, thats always been the goal and you did it so right the first time there wont ever be a need to rebuild anything! you are free from the soul searching ive had to do as to what i really want to DO, ive just sortof got a hobby that i have to decide how and when i want to let other people into. you set out to do what you are now doing, with wonderful results. if you continue to run and develop it like a professional planetarium from yesteryear, maybe word of mouth COULD go on and you wont be subject to word of mouth drop off. you are casting a wide net, and that is bound to succeed. ive got an extremely arcane little thing that now, Ive discovered my true motivation is even crazier - its making star projectors from scratch. that will never be more than an extremely small niche. but alot of the same principles, and the same love of the stars, permeates both our endeavors!
another interesting aspect seems to be that our physical space or footprint affects our destiny somewhat. you are big enough that the star chamber itself is all you need, with my smaller dome i needed that holding area that the barn provides, but then that allows other types of things to beckon as well - may as well do something while visitors sit there. it opens up an even more bewildering array of possiblities though too, i'm going to write more about that. you start with a blank canvass, there are just so MANY things you can do, it will drive you crazy if you let it!
so it seems i have been prototyping to get the right mission, whereas youve always known what youre right mission was - perhaps you are prototyping shows. i do think though you love that Minolta - youve GOT to say something about what you love, that will sustain you. just like building little planetariums is my love - what sustains us is what will keep us going indefinitely!
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:24:55 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 16 2014, 11:43 AM You always have the ability to put it in the proper words. Yes, "you start with a blank canvass, there are just so MANY things you can do, it will drive you crazy if you let it!" are our achilles' heal. Perhaps to quote the song, "I can't get no satisfaction", applies as well. I for one could not do what you do and that is start from scratch. I know some of my limitations and one of them is my satisfaction level. I have neither the patience nor the longevity to be able to build from scratch a planetarium projector that I would be satisfied with. It would be interesting to know the statistics as to how many people were involved in designing and building any planetarium projector. I read about one fellow who took ten years to build one. Taking two and a half years to build a dome from a kit just about did me in. Did I just move from one kind of purgatory to another?
Have I succeeded or am I just "hanging on by my fingernails" and/or "the skin of my teeth" (I didn't know that teeth had skin, oh well). But perhaps that is the definition of success. The fact that we continue "hanging on" long after others would have "thrown in the towel" (boy am I full of cliches today) and continue the internal battle within ourselves.
I guess the important thing is that we continue that battle and move forward, so engage, the best is yet to come.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:25:15 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 16 2014, 12:00 PM Well, it looks like another private show for next Saturday. The barn that my daughter trains at one person asked how my building was going as she must have mentioned it before. Anyway, the interest as usual is substantial as two shows are planed for just this group, 2pm and 5pm. Word of mouth is kind of like a tree or broken glass in that it keeps moving outward and expanding and going in many different directions. Who knows, I might just have one person in each show but that is one more then I had before.
A thought hit me (yes I know that it's rare) but I've had special shows so far for people that have had out of town guests. I'm kind of wondering if these requests will grow as the weather gets nicer and the number of out of town guests grows. Time will tell.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:25:40 GMT -7
Posted by: moonmagic Aug 19 2014, 01:26 PM Regardless of what we each use as our footprint, be it a square building, garage, dome, barn, storage shed, loft, or living room, EACH of those places are OUR laboratories and workshops. We all use them in different ways and at different times, yet they are a very integral part of us. It is a place we work, think, dream, create, and perhaps even inspire others. It hopefully plays such a significant role in our lives that some of what we accomplish there will be remembered favorably about each of us even when we are no longer here. While that is a rather lofty goal, perhaps even if not achieved to that level, maybe all that is really important is if it gives us pleasure by making our existence even more fulfilling. That is the common bond I detect. mm
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:26:00 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 20 2014, 04:18 PM I have often said that I would be totally satisfied to have this place only for myself. While I still believe that, I can't help but wonder just how much sharing it has helped to satisfy another part of my ego satisfaction quotient. I might need to share in order to be totally happy.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:26:17 GMT -7
Posted by: moonmagic Aug 26 2014, 05:45 PM Just another part of what makes this great. Again, a little "ham" in all of us. When I get any kind of "new" toy (be it just "new to me" or in rarer case "brand new") I usually want to show it off just a bit. Even if it's a new kite, I will likely have to take it out for a test spin and show it off to a few neighbors. (Probably BAD example, as the thought of running fast enough to get a kite into the air, just makes me tired!) mm
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:26:35 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Aug 27 2014, 10:40 AM You can have that running stuff. I'm happy just throwing switches and turning dials.
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:26:53 GMT -7
Posted by: chemed Sep 9 2014, 09:50 AM Great work, Ron! I've been quietly "lurking" and watching your progress. I would love to come see it in action sometime.
-Adam
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Post by Ron Walker on Aug 30, 2022 21:27:13 GMT -7
Posted by: Ron Walker Sep 9 2014, 11:24 AM Thanks Adam, your welcome to come by anytime. The dome is "usually" always ready to go.
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